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Episode Show Notes
What is engineering? What are the important aspects of engineering that anybody should know? Can we talk about all this without getting too deep into math? Engineer and researcher Sadhan Sathyaseelan joins the podcast to kick off a series of episodes meant to introduce engineering concepts to anyone, not just the people studying it in college.
The cover photo in this episode shows pyramids, which Sadhan mentions in the middle of the podcast as an example of possible engineering thinking in ancient times.>
Our opening music is called “Soar,” and our closing music is called “Polar,” both by artist Chris Pop. You can find more music by Chris Pop on SoundCloud. These are used under a Creative Commons Attribution License.
Subscribe and find more podcast information at k12engineering.net. Support Pios Labs with regular donations on Patreon, or send one-time contributions by buying us coffee. Thanks to our donors and listeners for making the show possible. The K12 Engineering Education Podcast is a production of Pios Labs.
Pius Wong 0:00
Shoutout to the incredible listeners and supporters of this show who are donating to it on Patreon. Getting the equipment, getting the software, planning things out -- This whole deal is only possible because of you. Thanks.
Welcome to a special installment of The K-12 Engineering Education Podcast, season three.
I'm Pius Wong, your host and interdisciplinary engineer in the education industry. Today I'm joined by Sadhan Sathyaseelan, another engineer and education researcher. And in today's episode, we're piloting a new podcast series that helps you straight-up learn hard engineering. Join us on this experiment next.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 0:53
Pius Wong 0:54
So Sadhan, you came to me several days ago, and you're like hey, Pius, I have an idea for a new show series for the podcast. I was like, what is it? And you told me -- Well, you just started your PhD recently, right?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 1:10
Pius Wong 1:11
And you're getting ideas about education and teaching more people about engineering.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 1:15
Pius Wong 1:17
And then I understand that you want to give the experience of going to engineering school to anyone who wants it through this podcast. Is that right?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 1:29
Yes, but not exactly like an engineer.
Pius Wong 1:31
I think that's a very polite way to say it. So what is it?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 1:35
Okay, so I'm thinking more like, Hey, how about we give people engineering concepts without the math?
Pius Wong 1:43
Without the mass concepts?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 1:44
Pius Wong 1:45
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 1:46
We both agree on the idea that essentially what we're doing with our K-12 engineering education podcast, this production, is, we want to educate people on basically what's happening in science and engineering knowledge.
Pius Wong 2:05
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 2:06
So I thought like, maybe we can also go a little bit further and teach people the terminology that's involved in engineering that people speak often. And if you look at everything happening in the world, with Musk sending people to Mars --
Pius Wong 2:23
Okay, I thought you were going in another direction. [laughs]
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 2:25
Yeah, essentially you see the newspapers full of -- Climate change, you know -- That's what
Pius Wong 2:32
I thought you were going to be like, okay, there's the business side and technology side, and there's this political side, you know, people ignoring --
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 2:39
Pius Wong 2:40
Science and knowledge and data.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 2:42
Yeah. I mean, I've had difficulties before I was an engineer to even understand what this means. Even after the engineering, I still did not really get some of the core concepts. It takes some time. So I thought like, Why can't we have a conversation like we usually do? And we don't get too technical. And we don't talk about any math. But we do talk about the fundamental concepts of these engineering ideas. And I think that that might equip people who are listening on just the terminologies and those concepts. So if they come across it anywhere else, they'll know what they're talking about.
Pius Wong 3:23
They'll actually know instead of just ignoring it, tuning out, or assuming.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 3:27
Pius Wong 3:27
That's a good goal.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 3:28
Yeah, I think if we make it into a really, really, you know, basic level, conceptual level, it should be great.
Pius Wong 3:36
So we're talking not just one episode, not just this one little segment that we're doing right now. You're saying several episodes, I think, to talk about different concepts.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 3:45
Yeah. So I'm thinking like, I think we should pick a sudden engineering field. There's mechanical engineering, talk about all of what mechanical engineering is. Doesn't matter how much time it takes.
Pius Wong 4:02
Sure. Yeah, that sounds good because you are a mechanical engineer.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 4:06
Pius Wong 4:06
I was, slash, am a mechanical engineer. So maybe that's a good way to start out.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 4:12
So we both have a lot of experience in that.
Pius Wong 4:14
I've already mentioned before --
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 4:16
I think you should do it again, because this is a new concept.
Pius Wong 4:21
I actually started out as a biomedical engineer, a bioengineer, initially, in fact, which is a little different from a biomedical engineer. My first full-time job was helping research, prosthetics, knee replacements, actually, the stuff that goes into your body when you get older, usually, and your knees start to give out because the arthritis is taking over, and you have surgeons cut out the bad parts and replace it with metal and bioactive materials and all that stuff. So, as a biomedical engineer, I used a lot of mechanical engineering. And then I decided to learn more about mechanical engineering and went to the University of Texas right here in Austin, studied robotics and biomechanics and all that stuff, and got my mechanical engineering degree.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 5:07
Masters in mechanical engineering.
Pius Wong 5:08
Masters and mechanical. Yeah.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 5:10
And you also have experience working in the field and teaching engineering.
Pius Wong 5:15
Yeah. So it's funny. After coming to UT, I -- when you go to grad school, they make you teach. And I always tell people, well, I never thought I was going to be a teacher, but I really liked it. I tried avoiding it forever. And UT made me teach, and I liked it. So they sucked me in. And I started teaching mechanical engineering stuff.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 5:34
Awesome. And I think you should also mention about you teaching teachers.
Pius Wong 5:40
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 5:41
Yeah, that's what the other podcast is about.
Pius Wong 5:43
That's where we met. Yeah. We worked at Engineer -- No, I forget, it's already been so long.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 5:50
It's Engineer Your World.
Pius Wong 5:51
Yeah, there is this high school curriculum called Engineer Your World. They aren't paying us right now to advertise it. But they teach high school kids how to do the fundamentals of engineering, engineering design, specifically. And I think for mechanical engineers, especially, what I learned in grad school here in Texas, in mechanical engineering -- I learned that design is so critical. And I learned so much. Props to UT grad school. I learned so much.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 6:18
Oh, yeah, I agree. I agree. Totally.
Pius Wong 6:20
Yeah. And I can name drop the different professors who I appreciated, but people can look it up. But I think that the stuff that I learned in grad school, we -- because you you also worked for them, Engineer Your World. We transferred that to the curriculum in Engineer Your World. And then we taught these high school teachers how to teach engineering design to other students. It's all very meta. Teaching teachers how to teach engineering.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 6:46
Multi-level, like Inception.
Pius Wong 6:47
Yes. Hey, so talk about your experience in engineering.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 6:50
Okay, so very similar to your science. So I'm a mechanical engineer. I have a Master's degree, and I work for Engineer Your World in developing high school curriculum in engineering.
Pius Wong 7:05
You did more than that, too. You helped teach engineering students about calculus and other stuff.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 7:10
Yes, that was a different project. But yes, both K-12 and also freshman level engineering.
Pius Wong 7:17
All the ages.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 7:19
Yeah, I guess so. Yeah.
Pius Wong 7:20
You did. You did like young kids K through 12, through undergrad, through Masters, then because of the teachers and the grad students.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 7:29
I never thought about that.
Pius Wong 7:30
You did teachers who are about to retire. You did all the ages.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 7:34
Okay. I have -- I did teach them, but I also learned a lot from them. So I guess it's more -- I don't really look at it as a: Oh, I taught these people. I guess it's a co-learning kind of a thing.
Pius Wong 7:44
That's very nice of you to say,
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 7:46
I think that's what it is.
Pius Wong 7:47
No, yeah. That's actually how I think it should be. I mean, the best teachers that I've always known have always -- it sounds sappy, but they've always said, Oh, I learned so much from teaching you students. But it's true.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 7:59
Yeah. It's like, I know the perception, but you know, that's what it is. So my motivation for doing this is, you know, like we discussed this. I do want to equip somebody who was not an engineering, somebody who hasn't done a lot of science, on the terminology we talk about in engineering. And that's my motive. And it's just an attempt to equip people who might not understand these concepts, or it might take a long time to get through these concepts. If we can give them like a very, very direct conceptualized idea of these concepts, I think that'll be a great -- equipping them with those terminologies and ideas will be a great thing. Because these are not like engineering as like a highly unique thing you need to spend years to understand, It's none of that. It's just the understanding of natural world. So that's what my motivation is. So I would love to hear yours. What's your motivation?
Pius Wong 9:00
It's very similar. I mean, in doing the podcast now for almost two -- Well, by the time this episode is up, it's probably been two years. I think that it's pretty clear that everyone thinks there should be more awareness and understanding of engineering concepts. And not just if you're going to be an engineer. I think that -- I believe that the common person -- that sounds so bad, but like the average person -- You should know about the internet, you should know about how cars work, you should know about climate change, to use that example, again. You should know about medical technology. Like, there's so many things that I think people should have that conceptual, fundamental, more -- that basic knowledge that sometimes isn't there. I think some people are afraid of technology or are afraid of engineering, or they're afraid to say anything about it for maybe sounding stupid. So it's like, Hey, I don't know so many things in engineering orotherwise. So it's like if I can say, I don't understand this on this podcast, maybe that'll help motivate other people to ask questions as well.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 10:11
No, I think you brought a very good point. So you are a biomedical engineer. I'm a mechanical engineer.
Pius Wong 10:16
Originally. I will say that my biomedical engineering knowledge has --
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 10:20
Same thing. My PhD is not exactly in mechanical engineering, as well.
Pius Wong 10:23
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 10:24
Yeah. But essentially what I, as a discipline, I have learned only what's in the realm of mechanical engineering. So you only learned what's in the realm of biomedical. So I guess, as we do our podcast, we'll have to learn a lot.
Pius Wong 10:38
Oh, totally, totally.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 10:39
So it's makes sense. It's just, we learn, and we try to communicate that.
Pius Wong 10:44
Yeah, one of the best pieces of advice, I think, that I got from a working engineer friend of mine from back in Tennessee -- He told me that, like, in his opinion, a good engineer is a good engineer. In other words, he meant like, oh, it doesn't really matter if you're a bioengineer, or a mechanical engineer, or an aerospace engineer. Yeah, there's all these different fields. And yes, engineering is so wide and so broad, but there comes a point, at least for him, where he was looking to hire people, not because they studied, you know, biomedical engineering in orthopedics, like I did or something, but because they've proven that they can problem-solve, that they can learn stuff that they don't know, and do it responsibly, efficiently, whatever. That's what he was looking for. And that transcends discipline.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 11:34
I think it's a very valid point. And I would also add a good grasp of basic concepts.
Pius Wong 11:42
You're right, being able to talk about things that they do know and that they don't know. There are some threads that are common amongst all these engineering disciplines, whether you're studying software, or robotics, or, you know, whatever. Chemical engineering. And I think that's kind of what he meant, like, yeah, have those fundamentals. I think math is one of those fundamentals.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 12:00
Yes, which we are not going to talk about. [laughs]
Pius Wong 12:02
But I think the whole point of this podcast is to make it interesting to talk about engineering. I'm an engineer, and I don't want to sit in front of a lecture hall, listening to someone drone on about how to do a Fourier transform again, for like, the third time in my life. Like, I'll just look it up on Wikipedia or whatever.
But what I do want is to talk about it, how it looks cool when you visualize Fourier transforms, how it's great for creating music and like -- There's all these other interesting aspects related to engineering that I think you can have a great conversation about without getting too stuck into the weeds, and I hope that's what we do.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 12:21
Yeah, I think that's exactly -- I think we're on the same page on what we want to do.
I was going on start off with asking the fundamental question. Engineering. I think that's the fundamental question I have.
Pius Wong 13:08
What is engineering?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 13:08
What is engineering? Like, we are engineers. So do we -- What is the fundamental definition or idea of what engineering is? What do you think it is?
Pius Wong 13:20
I'm resisting the temptation to look it up on Wikipedia.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 13:23
Oh, we are not looking up anything.
Pius Wong 13:25
No, no. So I'm actually reminded immediately of the very first episode that we recorded.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 13:30
Pius Wong 13:30
With you, me, and Rachel, actually, and I remember that in that pilot episode of this podcast, we asked something like that.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 13:37
Similar, kind of?
Pius Wong 13:38
Yeah, and I remember that we had a discussion of like, what's the difference between science and engineering and technology and all that stuff? And one of the points was, engineering might ask the question, What if? I think that was what someone had said.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 13:54
I remember that. Yes.
Pius Wong 13:55
You do? So beyond that, I'm thinking basically, I think engineering is the creation of new stuff. Maybe to -- if I wanted to say what they taught me in grad school, I would say -- and what we used to teach to our high school teachers -- I would say, engineering is the discipline where you learn how to study and create technology to meet the needs of people and customers and users.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 14:22
Okay, so what's the technology?
Pius Wong 14:25
Yeah. And maybe that's the stuff we create. For me, actually, I don't think it's just stuff that humans create. But I think that it includes stuff that humans create. What do you think?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 14:39
So there is a creativity part involved. But I think essentially what we're trying to do is, we take what's existing in terms of raw materials, and we manipulate it based on our understanding of science. We manipulated in a useful way that'll solve a certain activity that we want to perform in a more efficient way.
Pius Wong 15:06
To create a solution to a problem maybe, to perform a goal, like perform something according to a desire.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 15:14
Pius Wong 15:15
But I think that sounds accurate. When you said raw materials, it made me think like, yeah, tons of this engineered stuff is physical stuff. And maybe some of the stuff isn't, too. Like, it's stuff you can't physically touch, but it's still engineered.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 15:29
Right, right. Yeah.
Pius Wong 15:30
So I wonder how you would define that.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 15:32
With data. That's could be just raw data.
Pius Wong 15:35
Yeah. Or you can engineer a computer simulation or a mathematical model or something in Excel. I'm doing a lot of computer programming lately, so that's why that's on my brain. And then it makes me think, okay, is cooking engineering? Is painting engineering? I don't think so, in my opinion. Maybe there's aspects of it related to engineering. So what's the difference? Or do you even agree with me?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 16:05
I think there's a certain level of engineering involved in cooking. Art, I'm not entirely sure.
Pius Wong 16:11
There's overlap. I think in the Venn diagram of this --
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 16:13
Yeah, there's definitely an overlap on -- just the state of mind. You're not talking about what engineering is as a book definition. As a state of mind, I think --
Pius Wong 16:22
Engineering is a state of mind.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 16:23
It is a state of mind. Right?
Pius Wong 16:24
It's the phrase "engineering thinking" that teachers use officially in the state of Texas. Engineering thinking is written into the educational standards. So I think that's what you mean.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 16:34
I think when your friend in Tennessee said, a good engineer is a good engineer, he isn't talking about what the person knows. He's talking about a certain way of approaching things.
Pius Wong 16:42
Yeah, no, you're right. I didn't think about it that way. But yeah, he's probably thinking about your mindset, your way of solving problems.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 16:49
So engineering, is that a noun or verb? How is it -- How do you look at it?
Pius Wong 16:54
Officially it's both. I am an expert, of course. I'm actually not. But I have another podcast called Engineering Word Of The Day, and "engineering" was never one of my words, but I should do that.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 17:05
You should definitely.
Pius Wong 17:06
This is probably a podcast episode for that podcast. But it's definitely both a noun and a verb. I mean, according to the English language, engineering -- it's like the present tense, progressive form of an engineer. An engineer is a person who is an engineer, and then engineering is the act of --
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 17:28
it's an action that's happening.
Pius Wong 17:30
Problem-solving and creation of solutions.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 17:33
So I wonder when when engineering started, because right now it seems like when you talk about engineering, it seems like it's a phenomenon of the modern world and modern science, because it's based on a lot of modern science. We have all these universities teaching engineering, which seems like a very current thing, or a modern thing. But is it so? Because if you look at simple civil engineering -- Pyramids, thre was a certain level of engineering that was happening there.
Pius Wong 18:05
Oh, there totally is. I agree. And I think that experts would say that civil engineering was probably the oldest form of engineering. Basically, when the construction or creation of tools grew to such a scale where it required systematic thinking, meeting a bunch of customers' needs -- I think the definition of engineering is fuzzy, but I do think, like, once people started to have to build roadways or houses on a bigger scale --
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 18:38
I think you brought up to two important points that I love and I can relate to a lot. One is systematic thinking. And the other is customers.
Pius Wong 18:49
So what does that mean? What is systematic thinking? I know what I know I said it but now I have to think about what a systematic thinking mean.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 18:55
To me, it seems like -- okay, I'm going to think in terms of early man. Okay, engineering as we were looking at it as a state of mind, engineering was there for a long time when humanity started using tools. So they did engineer tools. And the way I'm thinking, what's the engineering there, is, there are so many ways they can approach this problem. But over time, they have learned to do it a certain way.
Pius Wong 19:22
To make the process faster, better.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 19:26
Optimal, better, yeah. In terms of how --
Pius Wong 19:29
They aren't just randomly making spears.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 19:31
They're not randomly doing it.
Pius Wong 19:32
Because that we would say is not -- I would say that's not engineering.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 19:35
Pius Wong 19:35
Randomly making stuff and just guessing which spearhead is the best one. Maybe that's not engineering.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 19:40
Yeah, trial and learn. They were using trial and learn, but there was a systematic way of doing it. Experimentations. Maybe over generations, not one person doing it.
Pius Wong 19:50
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 19:50
But there was an engineering and humanity to kind of go together.
Pius Wong 19:53
There's probably some engineering thinking, some strategies that carry over today.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 19:57
Definitely had to. And the other thing is customers. It's: Who are you building it for?
Pius Wong 20:03
That is so business-sounding, too.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 20:05
It's business-sounding, but we did talk about, okay, it needs to be useful. That's the difference between engineering and science.
Pius Wong 20:14
And an artist. Like there's an actual application.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 20:17
Utility. What's the utility? And if you're talking about utility, who's going to use this? And that's the customers, right? Even though it's business lingo, it's also very much engineering lingo.
Pius Wong 20:28
Could the customer be oneself? Like, can I design -- Can I engineer something just for me to use?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 20:35
I think so.
Pius Wong 20:35
Or does it have to be for other people. When we say customers, we can mean any person.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 20:40
Anybody. Users. Maybe that's better.
Pius Wong 20:45
I've hear that too. I've heard both.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 20:47
Pius Wong 20:47
They're not even exactly the same thing too, because, like, we talk about engineering products for kids, for example. The kids use, I don't know, the Nintendo Wii or something. But the parents are paying for it.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 21:00
That's the customer.
Pius Wong 21:02
So I don't know. There's fuzziness around these definitions.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 21:06
But I think in terms of engineering, itself, we are more leaning towards -- we listen to the user who's actually going to use this. And that's what we are designing it for, right? Customers is definitely on the business world side, when the money's involved. That's a pretty good definition.
Pius Wong 21:22
I mean, they engineer stuff for animals, too. Engineering a dog toy or something. I guess the human might be using that, as well. But there are things that you engineer for an animal, too, so maybe it's not even just humans. Or plants, or something.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 21:41
I guess end users. Users. What is it used for?
Pius Wong 21:44
Once we go into the future and we meet other aliens and everything, then we'll go on to any sentient or nonsentient being can be your customer. So I'm just waiting for the future.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 21:58
Oh, me too.
Pius Wong 22:01
And as, as people have learned, if they listen to the podcast, one of your favorite movies is Interstellar.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 22:08
Pius Wong 22:09
Lot of engineering in there.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 22:10
I would probably bring this up a lot in during --
Pius Wong 22:12
We'll relate every single discipline to Interstellar somehow.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 22:16
Probably, yeah. Well, maybe. But we will talk about movies. Movies are a great way to explain concepts that might otherwise be hard to visualize, or communicate just through a verbal podcast.
Pius Wong 22:30
Right. When people learn -- and teachers already know this, they've taught me this. There's many ways of learning. And one of the ways to learn, one of the ways to create designs, too, is learning through analogies. And so movies, I think, oftentimes let you visualize things that you might not be able to visualize otherwise. They give you analogies to think about.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 22:52
Pius Wong 22:53
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 22:53
I think pop culture.
Pius Wong 22:54
Right, you get to think about things in a more interesting way. If you're more engaged, maybe you'll remember it more. So I hope that we can --
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 23:01
We should definitely -- that's a great idea. I'm sure we would have done that anyway, but we're just making it -- putting it out there. We will be talking about pop culture in terms of engineering. We have to. I don't see how we can explain certain things without examples.
Pius Wong 23:18
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 23:18
Okay. That's awesome. So do you do -- Are you comfortable with whatever we discussed about engineering for what it is in its core?
Pius Wong 23:29
Yeah, we said a lot.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 23:30
Pius Wong 23:31
I'm comfortable with it. Let's distill it down. So if no one got anything from what they just listened to, what is like the one thing they should come away with about: What is engineering?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 23:43
Okay, from my perspective, I think one thing that everybody should understand is: engineering is not a modern phenomenon. It's something that humans have been doing for millennia. It would be to reframe the idea of, Oh, this is something new that I should learn from scratch. No, this is something that's already been happening in -- with humanity, in terms of looking at what engineering is. That's the get-away from my perspective. How about yours?
Pius Wong 24:12
I would only add the part that I always gravitate towards anyway, that engineering is design and creation of cool stuff to solve a problem or meet a need. I think that's what it is to me.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 24:30
Pius Wong 24:32
What do we have to look forward to for future episodes?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 24:36
So I think that'll be awesome to start with mechanical engineering.
Pius Wong 24:39
Awesome. So people listening are going to get a mini mechanical engineering degree.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 24:42
Crash course. Yes. [laughs]
Pius Wong 24:45
I could go up and talk to any engineer about mechanical stuff.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 24:48
So how detail are we gonna get into this? We established it's going to be mechanical engineering. We are going to talk about mechanical engineering. I'm kind of anticipating at least ten episodes in order talk about all the different branches or all the different topics.
Pius Wong 25:06
In mechanical engineering.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 25:07
Yeah, in it in a bird's eye view. Not so much in detail, but in a bird's eye view, what is mechanical -- what exactly happens in there? And what are the different concepts? And what different concepts do we learn after those concepts?
Pius Wong 25:21
It's like if you were designing a school, these are the main concepts that you think -- these are the classes that people should take.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 25:29
Pius Wong 25:30
But not a class. This is not a class. These are like, these are the coolest conversations that you can have when talking about mechanical engineering.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 25:37
Yeah, because math is not involved.
Pius Wong 25:41
Hey, I love math, man.
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 25:43
I'm not saying I don't love it, but it's not exactly accessible, if you talk with math with the average person.
Pius Wong 25:50
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 25:50
Okay. All right.
Pius Wong 25:52
Until next time, right?
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 25:53
I think so. So we'll come back and we'll talk about mechanical engineering.
Pius Wong 25:57
Sadhan Sathyaseelan 25:58
Awesome. Thanks, Pius.
Pius Wong 26:00
Thank you, listeners.
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Today our opening music is called "Soar," and our closing music is called "Polar," both by the artist Chrispop. You can find more music by Chrispop on Soundcloud under the username Chrispop99. That's Chris with a "ch," or just check the show notes for a link. The K12 Engineering Education Podcast is a production of my independent studio Pios Labs. As always, thanks for listening